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Rocket Talk: Why Doesn’t the TTC Ban Food?

By Torontoist

Have questions about the TTC? Rocket Talk is a regular Torontoist column, featuring TTC Chair Adam Giambrone and Director of Communications Brad Ross’s answers to Torontoist readers’ questions. Submit your questions to rockettalk@torontoist.com!

20090217rockettalk.jpg
Photo by spotmaticfanatic from the Torontoist Flickr Pool.

Reader Stephanie Abba asks:

Has there ever been any thought to banning food and drink on the subway, as they have done in Washington, D.C., and elsewhere?

TTC Chair Adam Giambrone says:

Many years ago, the TTC tried to ban food on the transit system, but was taken to the Ontario Municipal Board by people who were required to have food for medical reasons (such as diabetics who are required to maintain a certain blood sugar level). The Commission determined that issuing specific exemptions would be difficult and could cause issues with stigmatizing. Therefore, the TTC considers the issue closed, as it is unlikely the OHRC would rule differently.
I would also add that many people spend upwards of two hours a day commuting on the TTC, especially if they come from parts of Etobicoke and Scarborough. Much of that time is during prime meal-eating periods. If the TTC is going to be part of people’s lives to such a large extent, we need to expect that they will want or need to consume some food and drink from time to time while on the transit system. All that we ask is that riders be respectful of their fellow passengers, and put garbage in the proper receptacles to keep TTC facilities clean.
In addition, the TTC encourages people to make sure they have had enough to eat and drink before getting on the system. A major cause of delays is people fainting, and according to Toronto Emergency Medical Services (EMS)—which has a partnership with TTC to place paramedics in the subway—the most common cause of fainting is from low blood sugar balances and heavy, tight-fitting clothing. So according to EMS, while eating a proper breakfast at home is preferable, it’s better that you eat breakfast on board on the go than not eat breakfast at all.

CORRECTION: NOVEMBER 2, 2010, 3:06 PM This article originally said that it was an Ontario Human Rights Commission ruling that preventing the TTC from banning food; in fact, it was a July 2, 1987 ruling of the Ontario Municipal Board.

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Comments

  • http://undefined Jimbo

    I don’t have a problem with people eating on the subway, as long as they take their trash with them. But that’s true of any trash, food-related or not. My major problem is with the free commuter papers that people leave all over the place. I think people feel that leaving them on the trains is doing a service for other customers, who might pick them up and read them. But they just end up on the floor and all over the seats, causing a mess.
    That’s the biggest cause of litter, from what I can tell. How can we clean that up? PSAs urging people to take their papers with them when they leave and put them in the proper recycling containers?
    And don’t get me started on the people who leave papers behind at outdoor bus/streetcar stops, and then they end up as paper trash blowing all over the neighbourhood. Grrrr.

  • http://undefined Chester Pape

    I suspect either Giambrone or whomever briefed him is talking out of their dorsal orifice in the first section of the answer. At the very least there are some detail issues in understand the difference between the OHRC and the OHRT (hint, the former doesn’t issue rulings) and the way that system works. I have no memory of an attempted food ban (and I suspect some of their retail tenants especially at Eglinton and Bathurst would have been pretty exorcised if there had been) and there’s no mention of the issue in the online archive of OHRT rulings (although it only goes back to 2000). The reality is probably more along the lines of “every time this gets brought up we get legal advice that says we would probably lose a OHRT complaint so we’ve decided not to poke the bear”

  • http://undefined rek

    There have been system-wide PSA campaigns in recent years, most notable the “garbage goblins” (was it?) series from two or three years ago.

  • http://undefined Robin

    I spend 3 hours a day on the TTC commuting to and from my job. On the way to work I drink coffee. On the way back downtown from work I sometimes have to eat my dinner because I’m not going straight home. If the TTC banned food on the subway, I’d have to think about getting a car so that I would have the freedom to eat when I needed to.
    That being said, the trash from the food is the bigger issue. I can’t count the number of times that I’ve stepped in a puddle of old coffee or had to move a crumpled McDonald’s bag from a seat. That is the kind of thing that needs to be regulated, although I don’t know what the TTC can do about it.

  • http://undefined seenonflickr

    Has the ban on eating on the DC subway been a problem for diabetics? Are a lot of Washingtonian diabetics are collapsing?
    Adam Giambrone says: “All that we ask is that riders be respectful of their fellow passengers, and put garbage in the proper receptacles to keep TTC facilities clean.”
    I ask: What procedures are in place to actually get this to happen? Not a day goes by when I’m not confronted by food waste, garbage, and spilled drinks the length of a subway car.

  • http://undefined rek

    It does seem… unlikely. The TTC is not obligated to provide time or space for people to eat/drink, medical reasons or not.

  • http://undefined Andrew

    There’s a special place in hell for people who get street meat just before boarding the bus. Especially on hot days when that nasty cheap meat smell just lingers.
    It’s the same place in hell for the city licensing people who thought it would be a good idea to put a street meat stand right next to my usual bus stop.
    (Don’t get me wrong. I love me some street meat. But for reasons I don’t quite understand, if you’re not the one eating the meat, the smell is just plain wrong.)

  • http://undefined smc

    Good riddance Mr. Giambrone. Your response only serves to provide further evidence that you are the epitome of the type of incompetent, condescending and ill-informed politician that thrived under the stewardship of our current mayor.
    Here’s hoping the next regime (whoever it may be) can usher in a new breed of politician that makes decisions and public statements based on the premise that listening to constituents and the citizens of this great city is a worthwhile endeavour.

  • http://undefined Global Urbanist

    DC subway bans food??? Well what do you expect from a subway cars that are CARPETED.
    DC’s fares only cover 40% of their operating costs (70%-80% in Toronto) and they have the Federal Government as their commuters to cover the rest. TTC has to try a little harder raising money from retail rents and advertising in stations. A food ban wouldn’t go well with the convenient stores and snack shops.

  • http://piorkowski.ca/ qviri

    I’m really interested as to how you read any of that from this article. Listening to constituents about what, banning food? Even the comments here are split at best on this topic.

  • http://undefined David Toronto

    I can remember back in the ’50s and ’60s being hungry
    and eating a chocolate bar or a LifeSaver on the sly.
    Some passengers would make eating a sandwich a covert
    operation.
    Travel times were much less and the city was
    much smaller then.
    Maybe people are so involved with family and several
    jobs now that eating while in transit is a true
    necessity rather than the by-product of poor
    scheduling of one’s daily schedule.

  • Stells Bells

    Gee, smc, I am not really sure how you feel about Giambrone. Could you be a little more direct?
    P.s. re: “a new breed of politician” hahahahahaha silly wabbit, there is only one kind of politician. Get over it.

  • Stells Bells

    Always nice to get a completely irrelevant geezer report. Glad you figured out The Interwebs so you could share that.

  • http://undefined Stells Bells

    @ Robin, really, how long does it take you to eat this Very Important Dinner of yours in transit? Five, maybe ten minutes? Out of consideration for other people, could you really not consume your hot mess on a bench in a station or at your desk or at a food court, rather than subjecting everyone around you to your smells and possible spills?
    The TTC is not a cafeteria on wheels and rails. If you have blood glucose level issues, no one is going to begrudge you a bagel or a candy bar. But styro clam shell trays full of hot stinky crap, keep it off the transit. Maybe a pregnant woman needs to puke in your lap for you to get the message …

  • http://undefined thelemur

    I’ve never had a problem with holding on to leftovers or food packaging until I find the next garbage/recycling bin on leaving the train. I’m not sure how this translates to ‘must drop remaining coffee on floor/hide half-eaten sandwich under seat’ for others.

  • http://undefined Stells Bells

    and by “your” I didn’t mean you specifically, I mean people in general who won’t take a moment to consider the impact of their actions on others

  • http://undefined thelemur

    Definitions of ‘hot mess’, ‘stinky’ and ‘crap’ vary. Since it’s not feasible to enforce a ban on food altogether or on all but the most innocuous and relatively odourless foods (sample PA announcement: ‘Sir, this train is not going anywhere until you put that falafel away securely!’), the TTC could at least put waste bins on subway cars (which would also hold non-food waste). But then someone would have to attend to those.

  • http://undefined rich1299

    Always nice to get a completely irrelevant snide report. Glad you’re so full of yourself so you could share that.

  • http://undefined torontothegreat

    So do we ban anything that doesn’t smell to your standard? Whose “smell” standard are we using here?
    Lots of people don’t have time to eat in a food court or on a bench, that 5-10 minutes means (for some) getting fired or not. Getting the kids picked up on time or not, etc etc.
    There are far more stinkier people that use the TTC than people eating. It’s called public transit, have some tolerance and understanding. It doesnt’ kill you.

  • http://undefined Stells Bells

    go suck a lifesaver

  • http://undefined Stells Bells

    If your life success only has a 10-minute margin, you have real issues and I am truly sorry for your plight.
    And yes, it IS public transit, which is why I am saying, don’t be offensive if you can avoid it, which you can. Yes, you can. And no argument from me re: hygiene-absent people … they are as repulsive as the food stinkers.

  • http://undefined Jimbo

    I guess this is all par for the course wrt a discussion of trash. Some people just like to mess up the place.

  • http://undefined John

    Really Robin?
    You’re going to get a car because it gives you the freedom to eat when you want? Unless you’re saying that your commute will be so reduced that you will now have time to eat at home or a restaurant instead of having to do so en route, that’s not cool.
    When in a car, keep both hands on the wheel and your eyes on the road instead of a sandwich. Driving a car is a privilege, because cars can be enormously dangerous to everyone around them, and it’s not one that should be extended to people who think that eating (or chatting on a cell phone) while driving is even remotely acceptable.

  • http://undefined Andrew

    Just remember this comment in fifty years when you’re trying to figure out the brain-o-tron that your son bought you for PepsiChristmas.

  • http://undefined Ruhee

    Agreed. If you had the room in your bag or a free hand to carry food onto the TTC in the first place, you certainly have the ability to carry it off again. I always do this; once I forgot a banana peel on the subway after a really late shift at work and felt extremely guilty about it.
    I would be interested to see information about diabetic passengers, etc. on systems that have banned food and whether it has negatively affected them to a great degree.

  • http://undefined Andy

    This guy is so old, he was able to get his actual name as his username.

  • http://undefined nisi

    I think, like NYC, the TTC should require people to collapse their strollers if they are bringing children onto public transit. If they can do it in NYC, where most stations DO NOT have escalators and elevators, then we can surely do it here. Those SUV strollers are not seen in NYC because they are too hard to maneuver (is that really the “correct” spelling of manoeuvre?). It doesn’t appear to be too much of a hardship to make things easier for everyone.

  • http://undefined Richard

    I can see people having problems with overly odorous food.
    But when it comes to spills, it’s not a matter of discourteous or not. Nobody who spills something is doing it intentionally – and almost everyone feels bad about it. But at that level, you may as well be banning “accidents”.
    Spills are equivalent to puke.
    Shitty to deal with, yes. Unfortunate, yes. Unintentional (and probably unavoidable at the time), also yes.
    But don’t mis-label this as some sort of equivalence to being an asshole just because someone other than you really wanted a coffee on their 30 min train ride/45 min bus ride to or from work, and the driver suddenly had to hit the brakes.

  • http://undefined nredning

    I very literally laughed out loud at this comment.

  • http://undefined nredning

    No people are only discourteous now. I can’t think of the number of times when I was pregnant that I stood on the subway while people had their meals seated next to them.
    And typical response from a politician. At some point society has to stop bending over for every special interest. A diabetic knows their limits, and if they are low on sugar they will dive into something in their purse regardless.

  • http://undefined editrix

    Having had coffee spilled on me twice by riders, who think that there’s no need to apologize for their mistake, I heartily believe liquids should be banned on the TTC. If there’s a sudden stop and someone has a hot beverage, that’s a danger. If my trousers or whatever dry-cleanable article of clothing is spilled on and the spiller thinks there’s no obligation to right his wrong, can I make a claim to the TTC for my dry cleaning costs and inconvenience? Of course not. Therefore, ban the liquids.