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Queen’s Park Media Analysts Are So Ghetto

evonreidghetto.jpgThe Star reports this morning about U of T political science student Evon Reid (pictured). Reid applied for a job at Queen’s Park as a media analyst earlier this month and was waiting to hear back when an e-mail from Aileen Siu, a part-time contract employee (whose contract is probably about to end prematurely), landed in his inbox on Friday morning. Siu’s e-mail simply read: “This is the ghetto dude that I spoke to before.”
The e-mail was forwarded from Siu to another employee, but, according to The Star‘s original article, was copied to Reid accidentally. While no-one from the cabinet office where Siu worked had met with Reid face-to-face, they had spoken to both Evon and his Jamaican-accented mother over the phone.
Unsurprisingly, heads are rolling: Siu is insisting that the e-mail was “internal,” was not about anyone “outside [her] circle of friends,” and that “[she] don’t even know what nationality he is,” though, according to The Star, she “acknowledged that the term ["ghetto"] was negative.” Cabinet office manager Craig Sumi called and apologized on Reid’s machine, and now Giles Gherson, the cabinet officer’s deputy minister of communications and, coincidentally, The Star‘s recently-fired ex-Editor-in-Chief, is trying to arrange it so that he can apologize in person.
Reid (pretty far from whatever negative connotation of “ghetto” Siu was talking about—he has a belt clip for his Blackberry, after all) tried to avoid the “racism” angle today, telling The Star that “this isn’t a Confederate flag in a pickup truck…but it’s the kind of private view that affects decisions about someone like myself in the job market.”
Of course, politicians have jumped on the opportunity to treat Siu’s comment exactly like it was a Confederate flag in a pickup truck. PC leader John Tory is insisting that Dalton McGuinty apologize himself for the mistake, with NDPer Paul Ferreira agreeing and urging “sensitivity training” for all government employees. The correct response, though? Keep Reid’s name in the hat for the media analyst job, ditch Siu or—if she actually doesn’t think she was doing anything wrong—give her sensitivity training, and, ya know, try to avoid hiring people who think that “black” and “ghetto” are synonyms. A low-level part-time contract employee saying something extremely stupid is not an example of a systemic problem of racism in the Ontario government. In fact, it’s the kind of situation to which Hanlon’s razor applies perfectly: never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
UPDATE (07/25, 8:00 p.m.): Aileen Siu has resigned.
Photo of Evon Reid from his Facebook profile.

Comments

  • JakeKeating

    I interviewed for this position about two or three weeks ago.
    Not being a polisci student and my only knowledge of Ontario politics being whatever i get from perusing the Toronto Star, i was pretty confident i was not going to get the job.
    However, when i was interviewed i was absolutely dumbstruck by Ms. Siu’s lack of professionalism. The interview process was basically Ms. Siu and her colleague, who both seemed to be recent grads themselves, and their supervisor who seemed like d a legitimate government employee of several years. They made it clear that i would have to impress all three in order to get my second interview, and questions were shared equally between the three.
    Anyway, the problems came when their supervisor had to leave half way during the interview, and Siu and her colleague began joking around. Hey, i love jokes, initially they were doing a great deal to put me at ease, as i’m generally very tense in an interview. But they just kept going with it to the point where Siu was pretending to collapse drunk on the table and all focus was taken off asking me questions and trying to find out if i was the right person for the job, which was why I was there. When the questions did return to me, at least one of the questions ask was an illegal on as set forth by the ministry of labor, or however if in charge of making such guidelines (see, very under qualified for the job.) The question asked was “How do you plan on getting to work each day?” which as innocent as it sounds, cannot be asked in an interview situation. Now, should not the Ontario Government be following the same rules as its given all other HR departments in the province?
    And lame personal experience aside, my question is is Ms. Siu actually is such a low level contract employee, why would she be partially in charge of the important responsibility of interviewing and hiring and firing? How does someone who is unprofessional, with a low-level contract, and with such an obvious lack of discretion (“ghetto dude?” seriously?) get to the point where she has a great deal of responsibility? I just don’t understand it.

  • Jonathan Goldsbie

    It’s interesting that the Star article mentions “Giles Gherson, deputy minister of communications in the cabinet office,” without also mentioning that he’s the paper’s recently-fired editor-in-chief. Also note that the article has no byline, whereas yesterday’s piece was credited to staff reporter Linda Diebel.
    And I disagree with you that “Reid tried to avoid the ‘racism’ angle today.” I interpret his remark to mean that private attitudes can be just as racist and harmful as more overt expressions of White Supremacy.

  • guest

    Was this a less overt expression of White Supremacy by Ms. Siu?

  • guest

    It should also been mentioned that Aileen’s stripper name is Dallas Sweettower.
    [This comment originally linked to the Facebook profile for an "Aileen Siu," but likely not the Aileen Siu. Please see further discussion below—David]

  • Jonathan Goldsbie

    I mistakenly used the word “more” in that sentence, guest. Please pretend I hadn’t typed it.
    I mean, if I really wanted to, I could argue that Ms Siu’s comment was indeed a symptom of “White Supremacy” (here being used in the broadest sense, to refer to the societal context and unspoken and mostly unacknowledged ideology rather than a literal belief in the superiority of Whites), but in this case I simply misworded the sentence.

  • guest

    Give me a break. It may not be “of a systemic problem of racism in the Ontario government” but it is a of a systemic problem of racism in the population at large. And guess what? Members of the population make up the government.
    Clearly he was rejected for the job because of his race. How can that help you self esteem? He’s an honours student yet it still being dismissed because he’s black. Siu should be fired immediately.

  • David Topping

    “Clearly he was rejected for the job because of his race.”
    I’m sorry, but there is absolutely no way — at this point — that you can say that that’s “clear”; to the best of my knowledge, they haven’t even chosen to candidate who’s going to get the job yet. Who’s to say that there weren’t other, more qualified applicants? Obviously, this Siu mess throws a wrench in the whole hiring machine, but you can’t make an assertion like that based on the evidence out there so far.
    Also, a nit-picky point: everyone pursuing an undergraduate degree at U of T is technically an “honors” student; the university no longer offers non-honors Bachelor degrees. (The only exception is if your CGPA is not high enough when you intend to graduate, in which case, I believe, you can choose to accept a regular B.A. or B.Sc.) Not to discount anything that Reid’s done, but it’s a distinction that no-one has made yet.

  • joeclark

    My informed hypothesis is that this event can be blamed on top-posting, as so many E-mail ills can. People who top-post do not understand E-mail or their E-mail software (typically a Microsoft product, including the user-hostile Outlook). They have no real understanding even of what simple fields like To:, Cc:, and Bcc: really do. On numerous occasions I have had top-posted E-mails about me sent to me. I always call them on it, and they never ever understand what they did wrong.
    Government employees, whether “contract” or not, are inveterate top-posters. Lesson to be learned here: If you have to commit apparently racist remarks to a permanent and infinitely replicable medium, learn how E-mail works. Your way isn’t the right way.

  • guest

    I wonder if Siu is going to be doing some job-searching of her own in the near future…

  • guest

    joeclark: My informed hypothesis is that the average person (myself included) has no idea what you are talking about, and by being condescended to, will have no desire to find out either. This is a general interest blog – don’t assume we have any clue about the techno-esoterica you are lecturing us about and why we should care.

  • Jonathan Goldsbie

    After being bugged by Joe Clark a number of times about my “top-posting,” I finally looked up what it is. And he’s right.
    While I’m certainly not the hard-liner he is (I believe there are many instances when it is useful or justified), I agree that replying to a message while appending the entire original message underneath is usually unnecessary and needlessly cluttering.

  • David Topping

    “Top-posting” isn’t really the issue here; if this e-mail remained private, its contents would be just as problematic, if lesser-known.

  • guest

    Great reaction quote by Reid, and good commentary from Topping. It’s always nice to see when racially charged issues are discussed with some nuance. Ignorance attitudes are a much bigger problem than blatant racism in Toronto today.

  • guest

    Top-posting mistake or not, Ms. Siu is responsible for anything she says or writes, and writing it in email just leaves evidence. Any idiot, even she, should know that.

  • guest

    umm, why are you assuming he didn’t get the job because he was black? If Ms. Siu was talking about him to someone else it might have been because he was being considered for the job.

  • David Topping

    Guest #16, nowhere in my post or in this comment thread — other than the guest posting in the sixth comment that I already replied to — has anyone said that he didn’t get the job (whether because he was black or not). The job, from what I’ve heard, hasn’t even been filled yet, so it’s impossible to assert anything…
    That said, “ghetto dude” isn’t exactly a compliment for an employer to say about you when you’re going through the hiring process, so I’d be a little reluctant to claim that Siu’s e-mail forward was a good sign for Reid’s chances.

  • David Topping
  • rek

    Throw Siu to the wolves and move on.

  • ramanan

    The last paragraph from the latest star article is really worth paying attention to:

    He said he was uncomfortable when Gherson termed Aileen Siu, the sender of the “ghetto dude” email, as a recent university graduate and very young.
    Another civil servant Craig Sumi described Siu to the Star as “low level.”
    “She may be very low level to them but she was given a lot of responsibility,” said Reid. “She was my only link into the cabinet office so she was very important to me.”

  • Gloria

    Thanks, David, for pointing out pretty much every student coming out of U of T will be “honours.” Excellent how every paper is pointing it out though, as if a student with honours being demeaned in this manner is so much more shocking than a student without.

  • guest

    Craig Sumi does issues management training for Ontario government employees across the civil service. His seminars are half-decent but clearly he can’t manage an issue himself.

  • guest

    My understanding of what’s meant by being an “honours student” is not that one is enrolled in an honours PROGRAM, as has been rightly pointed out, most universities assume all students will stay for the 4 year honours program, but that they have honours GRADES. If this is so, then the first poster who mentioned the honours thing might be incorrect in saying the student was not in fact an honours student.

  • David Topping

    Re #23: There is no such thing, technically, as “Honors” grades at U of T, though. Students who do particularly well (CGPA over the course of a year of 3.50 or higher) are put on the Dean’s List (they are “Dean’s List Scholars”). Those who graduate with particularly high marks are referred to as graduating “With Distinction” or “With High Distinction,” depending on their grades (my source for this is this year’s U of T Arts & Science Calendar, though this information should be available online as well). You can be an “Honors” student on The Dean’s List each year, and graduate With High Distinction, or you can be an “Honors” student on academic probation.
    Of course, this is pure speculation on my part, because The Star could have just meant that Reid gets good grades, and this is pretty nitpicky. Still, the word choice of “Honors” at an institute like U of T where everyone is technically an honors student is problematic.

  • guest

    A number of you have mentioned Aileen’s facebook page and some information from it. The actual Aileen Siu is no longer on facebook. The information you are gathering, including her “fortune” and “stripper name” as posted on the site for fun, are from another Aileen, one who is probably receiving a lot of harsh messages on her page. I suggest that everyone backs off from that particular Aileen on facebook because she has nothing to do with the “ghetto dude” email situation.

  • David Topping

    Guest #25, if that’s your profile that you’re talking about, you can just say so — anonymously “suggest[ing] that everyone back off” someone elses Facebook profile is a strange request if you aren’t Aileen, or don’t know her. (After all, how would you know otherwise that it’s not the Aileen who we’re talking about here?)
    (Please feel free to e-mail me privately at david@torontoist.com rather than responding to this comment in the thread.)

  • guest

    At the risk of sounding like a stalker, but understanding that enough people on this forum have already read through Facebook Aileen Siu’s profile, I need to say this:
    The girl on Facebook is most likely not the Aileen Siu who is in the news.
    If you click on the current profile picture on Facebook and read the dates and times of her two comments on this picture, you’ll notice that they were typed in during business hours for the Ontario bureaucracy. And, you will recall that Queen’s Park recently banned and blocked its employees from using Facebook on government computers.
    Therefore, assuming that Aileen Siu from Queen’s Park was at work during the said dates and times, it is unlikely that she is the same girl whose Facebook account the information on “stripper name” and “fortune cookie” were taken from.

  • David Topping

    I also don’t think that the Aileen Siu who comes up as the first link on Facebook is the same one we’re talking about here (thanks, as well, to the poster of comment #25 for e-mailing me and explaining). I’m not going to remove any of the comments here about her profile, though I will remove the link to it in the fourth comment.
    (Also, it hardly matters now, as it seems that Aileen’s profile is no longer publicly available through searches, and to see it you now have to be her friend — which, in general, is a good setting for Facebook anyway.)

  • guest

    This is supposed to be insightful commentary? This is obviously so bad that I don’t think it’s really worth detailing the errors.

  • guest

    I don’t defend racism, but it may look I am when I point out that this guy is from Malvern.
    Malvern is a “ghetto” isn’t it?

  • David Topping

    True, Reid is from Malvern, which you could deem a “ghetto” compared to other places in the city (though that’d still be slang, and still be pretty inappropriate to say in this situation), but he was referred to as a “ghetto dude,” with ghetto as an adjective for Reid and not as a noun to describe where he’s from. If she had said “dude from the ghetto” it wouldn’t be much more appropriate, but at least it’d be easier to pin down what, exactly, Siu meant…

  • guest

    This is true, Siu made her own bed in this case. But Malvern is a ghetto and she certainly would have known that was where he is from.
    Since when did “ghetto” become slang for black/Jamaican anyway?
    I’m all for discussing race relations, but Siu’s exercise of poor judgment does not justify dismissing her as a social pariah.
    You have to wonder what sort of satisfaction Evon’s going to get out of this now. Seems he can’t really win, which is unfortunate. I’m just not sure who made race the issue.

  • David Topping

    Evon did: “”Ghetto dude? It means I’m black. It’s very insulting,” Reid told the Star yesterday. “It’s still pretty shocking to me.”"

  • guest

    You all seem not to get why this is a problem. Let me try to help.
    The emailed comment reflects an attitude in which, however stellar his CV, Mr. Reid’s racial and class bachground diminishes his accomplishments, something one would naturally expect to negatively affect his propspects for obtaining the job. It is as if she were saying, “Oh, this guy is from the ghetto, so we don’t have to take him seriously.” And in emailing the comment to colleagues this indicates that, at least in this particular office, this way o0of thinking is an acceptable part of the culture there.
    There is little doubt in my mind that the comment provides us with but a glimpse of difficulty blacks face in the job market and, more generally, life in Canada.
    Hope that helps.

  • AdamSchwabe

    The level to which some in this thread have stalked someone’s Facebook page (who may or may not even be related to the story) is not only hilarious, but also extremely creepy. Good on ya!

  • guest

    Oh no, I get why this is a problem and I don’t discount that Siu’s behaviour in this case may be part of what informs the class struggle – a struggle that is much harder for black citizens as an aggregate group both because of economic standing and outright racism.
    I just disagree with going after Siu as a racist social pariah. There’s a big difference between active discriminatory racism and sending an e-mail with an offhand remark that could prove a theory of marginalization based on race/class/geography.

  • ChrisD

    What is the difficulty with recognizing and acknowledging the existence of systemic racism. Systemic racism is not so much a matter of identifying individual racists, it is the operation of cultural assumptions that devalue and denigrate people or groups on the basis of race. Referring to someone as a “ghetto dude” is a rather clear display of such cultural assumptions. Malvern is not a “ghetto” and to refer to is as such also raises questions about underlying cultural assumptions.
    This was not just an act of stupidity, clumsiness or poor form. It is a clear example of the barriers that those racialized as black and other people of colour face on a daily basis.

  • alexwoodington

    http://www.petitiononline.com/apo/petition.html
    Might be of interest to some of you.

  • guest

    If Malvern’s diverse and concentrated ethnic population, the less affluent economic standing of many of its residents, gang crime, and/or popular press coverage is not enough not attract the label “ghetto” then I’m afraid I don’t know what does. I think most of the public would agree with me.
    If the above is a cultural assumption that denigrates those from
    Malvern, then there are a number of hooks on which to hang your hat apart from race. But race is made the issue in this case and many here say that it is “clear” that this is systemic racism at work.
    If Evon lived in Forest Hill and had the same dreadlocks and Jamaican mother, do you honestly think he would still have been referred to as “ghetto dude”?
    If you can’t make a strong argument that the answer to this question is “yes”, then you’re a long way from establishing the clarity of this incident as an example of systemic racism.
    But look around in this chain of comments, I haven’t seen anyone deny the existence of systemic racism. Going further, I don’t even see anyone denying that this incident may be an example of it. We just don’t know – but Evon and Linda Deibl seemed to have it figured out pretty quick.
    I feel bad for Evon. He can’t win now. Any decision on his application is going to be perceived as being influenced by the issue of race. The situation is kind of self-fulfilling in that way.
    But I don’t agree that it is at all clear that “ghetto dude” = black. I don’t even think referring to a place like Malvern as a “ghetto” is racist anymore than it is to say Forest Hill is full of rich white people.
    I just disagree with labelling Siu as a racist worthy of the social distinction being directed towards her. To break it down, I don’t think the punishment fits the crime in this case.
    But here’s something we should be able to agree on: Evon turning down jobs coming his way as a result of this controversy takes some man-size cojones and personal integrity. Good on him. I hope he finds peace out of this situation.

  • guest

    I agree with the poster who mentioned the problematic nature of a day-to-day working culture in which such a demeaning statement could be acceptable, as long as it’s internal. If that isn’t institutional racism, I don’t know what is.
    Ironically, it is typically not my style to instinctively attribute lack of success in the job market (or society in general) to discrimination. However, I applied for this position a few months ago as well (I am a Black Canadian) and Ms. Siu was on my interview panel. Despite holding a Master’s degree in politics, having government work experience, and performing quite well in the interview, I was not called back for the second and more ‘objective’ phase of the interview process (testing of technical skills). I was later told that candidates needed approval from EACH member of the panel in order to move forward in the interview process.
    I’m not writing about my personal experience to suggest that my racial background was the sole reason I was not asked to continue in the competition, nor did I think this was the reason at the time. However, I want to echo Mr. Reid’s sentiment that that Ms. Siu is not as ‘low level’ an employee as has been reported and had a considerable amount of power (although this type of conduct is regardless of rank in an organization).
    As someone who has been fundamentally opposed to assuming racial and class-based bias from the outset, this incident has been quite the rude awakening.

  • guest

    Guest #39, you really are missing the point. Stop for a moment and reflect. Look at the factors that you have indicated as the markers of a ‘ghetto’, “diverse and concentrated ethnic population, the less affluent economic standing of many of its residents, gang crime, and/or popular press coverage”. If all these factors existed in an area that does not have a “concentrated and ethically diverse population” would it still be described as a “ghetto”?. Furthermore, you may want to research the term ‘gang’ before using limited knowledge you gain from your 11:00PM news program to proclaim an entire neighbourhood as a “ghetto”. Do you even know the boundaries of Malvern? Have you ever visted? Are you aware that middle class families own their own homes and condominiums in this area? This is not an abandonded part of town with crumbling homes. Whether the public agrees with you are not, cannot change the facts.
    Yes their are some lower income parts, yes their is crime, just like in other fully developed parts of the Toronto, special focus can be given to North York.
    You then state, “I don’t even think referring to a place like Malvern as a “ghetto” is racist anymore than it is to say Forest Hill is full of rich white people.” Again, you are missing the point, their is a difference. It’s not simply the statement or the reference, it’s the impact. “ghetto” is loaded with negative connotations and when you picture the person from the “ghetto” you are picturing a particular stereotypical image. And like your post, the image is often that of a ” diverse and ethnic” person along with all the other negative stereotypes you have highlighted above, whether true or not. Whereas, the other part of your statement, does not use a negative term to describe the ‘rich white people” in Forest Hill, you refer to them as “rich white people”.
    And I ahve a question for you, guest #39, lets imagine that someone came up to you and say, I was talking to this ‘ghetto dude’, exactly what race would you picture in your mind? Please be honest. I think it is honest to say that for many people, the negative stereotype is solidified “ghetto=Black”. On this I can gurantee that the public would agree, if they choose to be honest.
    One is clearly racist (based on race) and the other is not. My intent is not to be judgemental here, I am just trying to add perspective. I am sure if Ms. Siu had perspective, she may not have sent that email, internal or not. Let Ms. Siu take whats coming to her. Did Evon and her other ‘victims’ deserve this type of treatment? My sympathies are with them, unfortunately I have no sympathy left over for Ms. Siu.

  • guest

    Guest 41: Note that I didn’t pass comment on the broad brush painting Malvern as a ghetto. Whether or not the characterization is “fair” is beside the point, it’s that the label is applied. I think we agree that Malvern is though of as a ghetto by those of us who watch the 11 o’clock news don’t we? I don’t think this is because people are inherently racist.
    I wouldn’t presume to know what the majority associated with the word “ghetto.” It’s used in a variety of contexts but this was the first time I’ve ever read it used as a descriptor of a human being. “Ghetto” to me means lower economic status (not in and of itself a bad thing – but a crude way to refer to anybody) or hailing from an area known to be a ghetto. Malvern would seem to apply in this case.
    The kind of vitriol directed at Siu for this e-mail is way out of proportion. It is an important discussion to be had and I’m sure she’s learned her lesson. But tracking this person down on Facebook and raking her over the coals for that note is out of line. This is starting to resemble a witchhunt.

  • guest

    Wow! The real issue- at least to me- is how he can be termed as a “ghetto dude”. I mean seriously…what is a “ghetto dude”? No matter the argument that is made about what context the term was used in, it has no reflection on his ability to perform this job, period! And, I am sure that it is safe enough to say that this comment was meant with a slurring undertone.
    Furthermore, if individuals don’t want to accept the backlash about what they say and do, then, well, perhaps those individuals should THINK before they say and do things. And hello to the above posting…Facebook is a free tool that can be and is often used in hiring of candidates (trust me, been there and done that). Thus, looking her up or not, she opened that can of worms through her own doing.
    This crap makes me sick and I am appalled to know that in 2007, this kind of debauchery still exists.

  • Marc Lostracco

    For a City employee who is in a position to hire staff (especially a position where there must be unanimous agreement across the board) making a comment like that shows a dreadful lack of judgment. Therefore, she shouldn’t be in a position to be hiring staff (and if she’s such a “low-level employee,” she certainly shouldn’t).
    Aside from the fact that nobody uses “ghetto” anymore, I think it’s pretty safe to say that ghetto=black in this instance, especially since the City is likely encouraging fair opportunity for minorities (including, perhaps, the employment of Aileen Siu).
    Even if Siu meant “Malvern,” it’s still a negative classification that, in this context, overshadows the other qualifications, which is not a classification that other people interviewing for the job might have had. It’s these subconscious cues that can make or break a job interview for someone, even if the interviewer believes they are being fair. Whereas his skin colour may play a factor in affirmative employment hiring practices, it is irrelevant to his address, and his address is irrelevant to the job.

  • David Topping
  • Jonathan Goldsbie

    The incident concerns the Government of Ontario (specifically, its Cabinet Office), Marc, not the City of Toronto.

  • guest

    This will be an unpopular point of view.
    I don’t disagree that Ms. Siu is both callow and foolish. But I do not think that her “assessment” of Mr. Reid was racist at all. Assuming that Mr. Reid presented himself at his interview looking as he did in the newspaper photo, I am not surprised at her intemperate characterization of him as a” ghetto dude”. That description arises from his appearance, *not* the colour of his skin.
    Bluntly, if you are going to apply for a button down, white collar job in government (or business, for that matter), lose the dreadlocks (and the soul patch). It’s that simple. Had the applicant been a white male, with long hair tied in a pony tail and wearing granny glasses, Ms. Siu might have described him as “hippie dude”; or a female applicant with magenta/orange streaked hair and a nose ring as “Goth chick”. And the story would not have made the papers.
    The underlying issue here is that Mr. Reid probably did not, unfortunately, receive good pointers on job hunting skills. [And still might not, because of the backlash from political correctness that is obscuring the root issue] The principle of “dressing for success” is still vital. One of its tenets is that you dress for the job that you want to have. Had Mr. Reid applied for a more informal summer student job as a lifeguard, waiter, campus research assistant, etc. his dreadlocks would likely not be an issue. But once you apply for a job in a corporate/government environment, you must look and dress the part, if you want to maximize your chances of being hired. Once established in a positon, you may have some leeway to be a bit unconventional, once you have proven yourself. But you don’t get that benefit of the doubt when you first knock at the door.
    Mr. Reid was applying for a job as a media analyst in government. The job title, at a minimum, suggests that the job requires a measure of seriousness and good judgment. It does not inspire confidence where the candidate’s choice of hair style/personal grooming creates cognitive dissonance by evoking an association with ganja culture, as dreadlocks do. Again, not a race issue since a “hippie” or “Goth” image on a white person would likewise cause the same type of dissonance.
    I’m not saying that any of this is fair. But it is reality. First impressions matter, especially in job interviews, regardless of the colour of your skin.

  • David Topping

    Arg. There are so many things wrong about that reply that I don’t even know where to begin.
    “Assuming that Mr. Reid presented himself at his interview looking as he did in the newspaper photo, I am not surprised at her intemperate characterization of him as a” ghetto dude”. That description arises from his appearance, *not* the colour of his skin.”
    Mr. Reid never had an in-person interview (the article reads that “…no-one from the cabinet office where Siu worked had met with Reid face-to-face”) so Siu never saw him, which makes your entire argument completely baseless. Nonetheless, the suggestion that Reid’s dreadlocks are the problem here — that his dreadlocks make him “ghetto” and that his dreadlocks prevented him from getting the job (rightly so, in your argument) — is totally insane.

  • andrew

    Er, have you ever seen media analysts? People who’s job it is to interpret just what the heck the media is saying about the government and various issues need some cool factor aspect to their appearance in order for the uptight politicians to be able to trust that they are in touch with the zeitgeist. The soul patch is just that right touch – not too damn big or unkempt, but just rebellious enough. He’s got good looking hair. Dreads – those little locks he’s got – are also just slightly edgy. Not massive and big and suggesting fully years of locking, but nicely alluding to some Caribbean heritage that provides good cues for his potential bosses that here’s someone who will also be able to provide some analysis from a [gasp] minority perspective.
    Seriously, come by the Pink Palace one day. Reid wouldn’t be out of place in the slightest. With that blackberry in hand, he’d fit in with no problem. Visually, at least. I have no idea whether he’s a team player, possesses initiative and independent thinking, has critical thinking, or that weird “fit” kind of thing that HR people look for – but then again, based on his resume, neither did anybody else.

  • guest

    David, your response to guest #47 hit the ‘nail’ on the head. Thank you for your reply, it says it all.
    And Ms. Siu has ‘resigned’???? good for her. She does need some time to reflect. Maybe she should write a book, there are important lessons to be learned from this, I am sure.

  • guest

    Please! I strongly disagree with your ‘stupidity’ assessment, because to me Siu’s comments surface a clear racist undertone. To assess one you’ve never met, whose resume and creditials clearly present a well-educated individual who deserved a call for an interview, as a ‘ghetto-dude’ solely based on connecting a person of colour to a ‘ghetto’ is purely racist no matter how and which way you turn it. It’s time to stop beating around the bush with ironing things over for comfort and call a spade a spade. And why are our tax dollars and resources being used for the purpose of malicious, racist emails “to a circle of friends’ anyways? I thought there was a OPS Government Policy that did not allow for this.

  • guest

    Though I am disappointed in her idiotic remark, I am even more disappointed in the instinctive calls against the “racism” that didn’t even exist in this case.
    Even if you people think it is likely that she was being racist, how can you could be SURE she was being racist? He actually DOES live in a “ghetto” area. Ghetto is a WIDELY used term by the youth to mean poor or if they live in a less priviledged area. How deprived do you people have to be to stalk her on Facebook and find out her phone number?
    I’ll admit that when I was first read the excellently written article in the Star (in terms of spin and emotion-grabbing), I was angry at her as well, thinking it was racism for sure. Then I read a bit closer. The evidence was lacking. The story was barebones except for that e-mail and him staying that he should’ve been given an interview as if it was a fact. How did he know how he compared to the other candidates? The WHOLE story was full of spin. Blaming the entire McGuinty government? Just tasteless. I’ll admit that he’s pretty smart to using “being black” as his advantage.
    She called him a ghetto dude and forwarded his resume to a coworker to look over. Do you think she could have had anything but positive intentions with that action? What was her coworker going to do? Laugh with her at his blackness and how he is so skilled at the same time? She could have easily thrown out his resume and gave him a rejection call back if she actually was racist. If he really deserved an interview, even she would not have rejected him for being black. It’s even less likely that she would forward his excellent resume to a coworker who would ask her why she didn’t hire him.
    I see her remark as a label. You get floods of candidates when reviewing resumes. You apply labels sometimes to distinguish them and create interesting conversation. Discriminatory, stupid and unprofessional? Yes. Did it actually affect his chances to get an interview? Hell no. Racist? Are you KIDDING me?

  • guest

    My point is not to bash his resume, but to put things into perspective.
    Let’s take a look at his “stellar” resume.
    “A summer course in international management strategies at the University of Hong Kong; one credit short of an honours degree in political science at U of T; completed project on paradigm shifts in United States foreign policy; working on another to evaluate the effects of electoral reform on public policy.”
    Wow a summer course at HK U? Useless. Incomplete poli sci degree? Useless. Completed academic project on US foreign policy? Useless. Another random academic project? Useless.
    “Extensive job experience; Get Reel Festival organizer; founder of Canadian International Peace project (at U of T’s Scarborough campus); participant in Forum for Young Canadians on Parliament Hill; etc., etc.”
    What was his job experience? Lovely how they DID NOT list it. It must have been so noteworthy to make him seem like a great candidate that they didn’t even list any examples. Where’d he work? McDonald’s? Ugh.
    One of the volunteer organizers for Get Reel? Whoopidoo. I have friends who did stuff like that when they were in high school. Canadian International Peace project founder UofT scarborough chapter. President of a uni club- could mean nothing- tons of clubs in uni do jack. Participant in a forum? … so? I was a participant at a debate club once… ya.
    “In a reference letter, an executive with White Oaks Conference Resort called Reid “truly a valuable asset to our company … a trustworthy, dependable young man that takes initiative in work that has to be done.”
    He’s got a reference letter? Give the man a medal.
    ” etc., etc.”
    Oh lord, that was the best his resume had to offer? The best the media could pull out to make him seem like the perfect, poor candidate? No significant job experience, and “etc. etc.” is never a good sign when what they list was just decent extra-curricular and volunteer experience, which contrary to popular belief, is NOT enough for a media analyst “dream job”.
    He would not have been given a damn interview anyways with that garbage resume.

  • guest

    ” Siu never saw him, which makes your entire argument completely baseless”
    What makes your “racism” argument any less baseless and insane?

  • David Topping

    My argument is — and has always been — that Siu’s statement was not necessarily racist, just stupid. And I’ve already defended my argument’s basis, both in the article itself and in the subsequent comments. I do agree with you that The Star was really painting Reid out to be this fantastic intelligent job applicant — though they (and you) miss the point that what Siu said is inappropriate, regardless of Reid’s qualifications.

  • guest

    Guest/Post #47 here.
    In reply to “David Topping”, whose comments
    “Nonetheless, the suggestion that Reid’s dreadlocks are the problem here — that his dreadlocks make him “ghetto” and that his dreadlocks prevented him from getting the job (rightly so, in your argument) — is totally insane”,
    is neither cogent, nor well reasoned.
    Firstly, the reports that I saw suggested that Ms. Siu had met Mr. Reid, since the subsequent e-mail correspondence was of a follow-up nature. Besides, Ms. Siu would have no basis to conclude, sight unseen, that Mr. Reid was black. Reid is a very common name.
    Secondly, nowhere did I say that Evon Reid was “rightly” prevented from getting a job because of his dreadlocks.
    But neither is he entitled to a job (or even an interview, for that matter) because of his skin color. He is *competing*, along with others who have applied, for a job with the Ontario government. It would be clearly wrong for him to be screened out from consideration because of his skin color. But that doesn’t mean he gets an automatic pass on other factors upon which job candidates (regardless of race)are judged, whether you like it or not.
    It is his *choice* to have dreadlocks and a soul patch. That *voluntary* statement of personal style/grooming sends a message and people will inevitably draw a conclusion from it. There are some jobs/contexts where dreadlocks and a soul patch would be seen as “cool” and having them would not hurt a job applicant (and might even help). Government is not one of them.
    If he chooses to show up at an interview for a button down job with dreadlocks and a soul patch, he is sabotaging his own chances of advancing in the job competition. Think of it like a track race. You could run the race in street shoes or hiking boots. You might even win. But you will have a better chance of winning if you run in track shoes as opposed to boots.
    The bottom line is that you adopt conservative grooming and dress when applying for certain kinds of jobs, no matter the color of your skin. Unconventional hair styles (dreadlocks, mohawks, odd coloured dye jobs), soul patches, nose rings, large visible tattoos, and unsuitable dress all fail that test. Present yourself that way and you increase your chances of being screened out. It’s that simple. [Would you expect a (white) job applicant to be taken seriously if he showed up to a government job interview in shorts, T-shirts and flip flops?. Same principle.]
    Some time, I invite you to look at black men who are successful executives. They do not wear dreadlocks and a soul patch. Not in big business. Or finance. Or law. Or banking. Or government.
    Mr. Reid is ambitious. Good for him. But job hunting is a skill. He may not know the finer points of how to put his best foot forward. I find it sad that the hysterical uproar of political correctness is giving him all aid short of real help. By focusing on the race issue and emphasizing how he has become a “victim”, there is less chance that he will able to learn from any presentation mistakes that he might have made and improve his chances of ultimately getting a job that he wants.

  • guest

    Alright, sorry David. I did not realize you were the article writer. I was getting too frustrated after reading through the comments in this witch hunt of a mess.
    I’ll state my view simply too. I too agree that her comment was inappropriate. She should make a public apology instead of completely denying like she did. Should she have been fired though (resigned)? I don’t think so.
    I think he does deserve SOME sort of position in media though. He completely manipulated the public into a frenzy mob with his clever quotes- with the help of the reporter of course.

  • David Topping

    To Guest #56,
    “…the reports that I saw suggested that Ms. Siu had met Mr. Reid, since the subsequent e-mail correspondence was of a follow-up nature. Besides, Ms. Siu would have no basis to conclude, sight unseen, that Mr. Reid was black. Reid is a very common name.”
    The news articles that I based my article here on said that they had made no face-to-face contact; Siu had previously spoken to Reid and his mother on the phone (again, I also mentioned this pretty lucidly in my article at the top of this page you’re commenting on right now)., but that’s it. What “reports” are you talking about that suggest they met face-to-face?
    “But neither is he entitled to a job (or even an interview, for that matter) because of his skin color. He is *competing*, along with others who have applied, for a job with the Ontario government. It would be clearly wrong for him to be screened out from consideration because of his skin color. But that doesn’t mean he gets an automatic pass on other factors upon which job candidates (regardless of race)are judged, whether you like it or not.”
    I agree.
    “It is his *choice* to have dreadlocks and a soul patch. That *voluntary* statement of personal style/grooming sends a message and people will inevitably draw a conclusion from it. There are some jobs/contexts where dreadlocks and a soul patch would be seen as “cool” and having them would not hurt a job applicant (and might even help). Government is not one of them.”
    As I said before, his dreadlocks are completely irrelevant, because Siu never saw Reid. Unless dreadlocks emit some kind of audible “beep” over phones (I’m not sure; I’ve never had them), it’s a fruitless and irrelevant argument to be having.
    Please, go back, and check your “reports” again. I think you’ll find what I did: that no face-to-face meeting between Siu and Reid ever took place, and that the issue of his dreadlocks is, like before, one that has nothing to do with anything.

  • Marc Lostracco

    Dreadlocks and a soul patch are inappropriate?! What a shitty workplace that sounds like. Do you think it’s also inappropriate for women to be showing up in pants, flat heels and short hair when they’re supposed to be sitting out at a desk typing and lookin’ purty?

  • guest

    What an inappropriate and unprofessional act from Ms. Siu. Being an Asian myself, I am ashamed that Ms. Siu has called/named a good person by this name.
    How can Ms. Siu be of a person who holds the positoin of screening candidates when she, herself, does not possess the correct ethical standards?
    Shame on Ms. Siu and I wish Mr. Reid all the best in all of his future endeavours and pursues.

  • David Topping

    The Star has yet another article, this time about the mistaken Facebook identity thing with Aileen Siu.

  • guest

    Shame on the Torontoist for allowing postings unfairly targeting an innocent person.
    Perhaps your site needs a policy to prevent such misidentification in the future.

  • David Topping

    Guest #62, you ought to read the comments more carefully. After some back-and-forth, I removed the link to her profile, appended an editor’s note to the bottom of the comment that did link to it, and explained that we were (in all likelihood) talking about the wrong Aileen Siu.

  • guest

    David, you’re missing the point. This shouldn’t have happened in the first place.
    Torontoist should not allow links to Facebook profiles, or to other personal information unless it’s verified and it serves a valid purpose.
    I read the back-and-forth, and was quite frankly upset that your initial reaction to the news was to be suspicious of the posters’ intentions and motivation.
    Does Torontoist have a policy on this? Maybe it’s time to get one.

  • David Topping

    Aileen Siu’s profile was, at the time this was going on, publicly searchable on Facebook, and anyone who was a member of Facebook (so, a hell of a lot of people in Toronto) could see the entire thing. The information that she put in her profile was there for the city to see; it’s not Torontoist’s job to ensure that people are using Facebook to protect their private information properly. Keep in mind that the link was provided in the comments, with a joking reference to her “stripper name,” not in the actual article itself. The moment that I found out that the Aileen Siu whose profile was linked to was not the same one we were talking about, I removed the link and posted an update in the comments.
    (It’s worth noting that when someone commented several times with [the real] Aileen’s phone number and e-mail address and told people to call her let her know that she was a “racist biatch,” I removed those comments.)

  • guest

    “it’s not Torontoist’s job to ensure that people are using Facebook to protect their private information properly.”
    You’re right. But it is your responsibility to ensure events like this don’t happen. Torontoist carried the story and allowed users to link to a Facebook profile – at that point it is very much your responsibility.
    I’m very happy you didn’t put the link in your original story, and that you edited out the comments that you did, but there still has to be some blame put on your shoulders. You allowed others to use this site as a conduit to target the wrong Aileen. What will Torontoist do to correct this situation (maybe I missed the apolgoy), and what will Torontoist do to prevent future mishaps?
    Also the issue must be raised – even if the links did point to the “real” Aileen Siu, does that make it right. Shielding yourself with the argument “it’s public information” is weak and ignores the role this site plays.
    The role Torontoist played was too reactive, I ask again does Torontoist have any guidelines regarding linking to personal information of citizens (Be the information public, private or otherwise)?

  • guest

    Its great how forums allow people to spread misinformation. The damage is done and it will continue to follow Aileen (U of Ryerson grad) siu.
    To add those that spread misinformation and those that went along with it, their actions are far more damaging than what the (government) alieen siu did

  • David Topping

    I do think, in light of what happened, that we will have to be more careful about allowing commenters to link to Facebook profiles — particularly in stories like this one. The reason why I didn’t edit out the link right away was because of the intent of it (it was more poking fun than encouraging harassment — the latter was the reason I removed her phone number).
    That said, I do defend the profile being linked in this case (though I’m of course sorry that the wrong Aileen Siu was caught up in this mess). Finding it required typing in someone’s name — a name that The Star has printed dozens of times over the past week — into a search box on a website with some 710,000 members contained within our city’s borders. There was nothing sneaky about it — it’s about the equivalent of Googling someone. I think more than anything else, it underscores the need for people to be careful about what information they publicly share online.

  • guest

    David, Torontoist shouldn’t have posted the link to the Facebook page until it had verified that it was the correct Aileen. That is called responsible journalism.
    It doesn’t take too much intelligence to figure out that there might be more than one person in Toronto with a Facebook page with the name Aileen Siu. It also doesn’t take too much intelligence to figure out that running an internet comments page attracts people who might attack Aileen Siu, which should have made you think about publishing the correct info.
    Instead of trying to dodge responsiblity, acknowledge that Torontoist screwed up and that you have now created a policy by which this will never happen again.
    It seems that while Torontoist tries very hard to be “cool” and intentionally take shots at mistakes and screw-ups by others, it has very little integrity when dealing with it’s own gaffes.

  • David Topping

    1. I didn’t post the link to her profile — someone commenting did (I also didn’t “publish” it, the individual commenting did). While I did see the comment and chose not to unpublish it, that’s a very important distinction.
    2. I apologized in my previous comment that the wrong Aileen Siu was involved. It is unfortunate, but you’re blowing this way out of proportion. That said, if we’re going to make a policy change on linking to publicly available information online — which I don’t think we will — it won’t happen immediately.
    If you want to continue this further, please contact me privately at david@torontoist.com, because I’m done defending my integrity to a person who won’t even provide their name and e-mail address to stand behind what they’re saying.

  • guest

    David, it’s comical, and rather juvenile, that you complain about a comments page (that your organization created) which allows persons to leave anonymous messages. What’s next? Are you going to stomp your feet and pout? Or maybe throw things across the room?
    Perhaps, you now have a small taste for what the wrong Aileen went through as a result of your misguided decision to publish a false link.
    Note to David and Torontoist: it’s your site, so anything posted on it is your responsiblity and is considered to be published even if you didn’t personally do it. If you don’t want that responsibility, then don’t have a comments page. Responsible news media who allow web comments, vet those comments before posting them.
    If someone had posted racist comments, you would have “unpublished” that info very quickly. As for racism, allowing a link to an Aileen Sui Facebook page (without verifying it) on your website is inherently racist in itself. It suggests that any asian woman from Toronto with the name Aileen Siu must be the one in question. Perhaps David, you and Torontoist need some sensitivity training as well.
    Further note to Torontoist and David: Day 1 of first year journalism is about verifying information. Get the class notes if you missed that day.
    In any event, choosing to “unpublish” a link which you didn’t have the good sense to verify, displays reckless disregard for what is posted on your site; another hallmark of poor integrity.
    Your decision caused this innocent woman a tremendous amount of harm and, in your rather lame apology (which wasn’t really an apology at all), you then suggested that people should be more careful about what is posted on the internet. In other words, you insinuated that she was partly to blame – another nice deflection of responsibility.
    Suggesting that this is blown out of proportion, is insulting to the wrong Aileen.
    Final note to David and Torontoist: basic public relations strategy when you screw up is to accept responsibility, apologize (without suggesting that the complainant is also to blame) and then put in place measures to ensure that the gaffe never happens again. That way, things won’t get “blown out of proportion.”

  • David Topping

    As I said, I’m done defending my — and Torontoist’s — integrity.

  • Marc Lostracco

    I hardly think a now-unpublished Torontoist reader comment posted in response to this article caused a “tremendous amount of harm” to the other Aileen Siu. The vast majority of the allegedly significant harm was due to other bloggers posting her profile, picture and email address (which they certainly didn’t get from us), by the people who think it was helpful to send her nasty emails, the commenters in the forums (including ours), and by the original Aileen Siu and her ignorant email.
    As per our usual practice, if one of our readers posts something questionable or offensive in the comments, it is reviewed when discovered or brought to our attention (and even re-reviewed) and then either unpublished or left for further discussion. The comment in question was removed. Though I acknowledge that having the same name as the other Aileen Siu was pretty sucky this week, I fully agree with David that you are blowing this entirely out of proportion as it pertains to Torontoist.
    If there’s anyone blowing things out of proportion, I’d say it was the Star, who has been all over this situation like a fat kid on a Smartie.

  • guest

    It’s clear that Torontoist screwed up by not verifying that you had the right Aileen Siu. We thank you for removing the erroneous comments and link.
    Now, I’d like to suggest that you stop trying to minimize and/or justify the damage done, and apologize properly. In so doing, you might manage to convince some of your recently disaffected readers that patronizing your site is still worthwhile. After all, if the information on your site isn’t accurate, and if you refuse to apologize for any inaccuracies when they’re brought to your attention…as any good news organization would…what’s the point of coming here?
    JD MacDonald – posting for the internet action group “Defenders of the Web Community”

  • guest

    I’m sorry, but the tone all this page are of bleeding heart hypocrites.
    Who has NOT used a racist inuendo sometime in their life? Who? And when one uses it (as people inevitably do), it is because someone is racist, or because someone is just making a joke?
    And who has not mis-sent something important to someone else. I bet you were glad that the person who you sent it to didn’t break your balls over it.
    And third, where are all of your from? Rosedale? If grew up in parts of North York, Sauga, Scarboro, and went through the public school system, you would understand the term “ghetto” does not mean “BLACK”.
    “Ghetto” means something that is a little rough around the edges, but otherwise a good product. Many people use the term to refer to “ghetto Chinese restaurants”… and that’s why they are so good! They don’t waste time with decor and superficials, they simply delivery good food. This meaning is the true context of using the word ghetto when you grow up in an unsheltered life.
    So before you judge others for a mistake and use of the word “ghetto”, you better make it a point to look at your own behavior, actions and understanding of the people of Toronto.
    Best,
    CB

  • David Topping

    Guest #74, first, I’d like to clarify the entire situation, as it seems like some people may be confused as to what happened here.
    Nowhere in my article did I link to Aileen Siu’s Facebook profile, even though I saw it as I was writing. The article as it appears now (up to the “UPDATE:”) is as it was when it was originally published on the front page.
    Additionally, I did not engage with the comment that did link to her profile in any way other than by letting it stand on the site and not unpublishing it (the same way that I have let the comments criticizing me for doing so remain published). When someone anonymously posted to say that the link to Aileen Siu’s Facebook profile might be the wrong, I asked the person to contact me so that I could make sure that her information was correct. When they did, and when it was clear that the profile was likely of the wrong Aileen Siu, I immediately removed the link and posted an editor’s note with it, as well as a comment indicating that I had done as much. When a user commented later with the real Aileen Siu’s e-mail address and phone number and encouraged people to call her a “racist biatch,” I removed the comment and sent an e-mail to the user who left it saying I removed it (they were a registered commenter, not a “guest”).
    As Marc pointed out, the harassment that Siu has experienced — certainly every single instance of harassment that The Star‘s article mentioned — was not posted on Torontoist and, I hope, did not come from Torontoist’s readership. Other blogs, websites, Facebook groups, and online forums posted Siu’s picture, phone number, and other personal information.
    At the time, I didn’t think that the comment here — a link to her profile and a joke about her “stripper name” as it was displayed on her Facebook profile — was a big deal. All that said, what I should have done when I saw a comment that linked to Siu’s Facebook profile was remove it, regardless of whether or not she was the “right” Siu. I’m sorry that I didn’t remove the link, and I certainly hope that we weren’t responsible for any of the grief Siu’s going through. If we were, I’m sorry for that, too.
    While we have no official policy concerning comments containing links to Facebook profiles, we will be far more careful in the future, especially in situations like this one. (You’ll note that though I got Evon’s photo from his Facebook profile, which was also publicly visible, I didn’t link to his page, either.)
    I think — I hope — that we can all move on now.

  • guest

    You have removed the offending post, affirmed that you will do your utmost to exercise greater caution in the future, and apologized unequivocally for any undue suffering you may have caused. I don’t see how anyone could possibly ask for more. You have earned our gratitude, and our respect.
    Sincerely, JD MacDonald – posting for the internet action group “Defenders of the Web Community”

  • guest

    It doesn’t matter if the “link to Facebook” is there or not. If you know someone’s name, and have a facebook account, you can look it up.
    The real issue is: why is hell is there such an over-reaction on the part of bloggers? You are stooping so low as get on someone’s facebook account? Getting her phone number? What are you guys – stalkers?
    Take a step back, and recognize that for this girl Siu, having her photo plastered all over the internet and labelled a “racist” is utterly damning her image for a long time. This is a case where the punishment is WORSE than the crime (or mistake, as in Siu’s case).
    David Topping – you don’t like people when they break your balls over a stupid mistake do you? (As your “link to facebook” becomes a big issue)
    If you don’t like it… then don’t do it to other people.

  • guest

    I agree completely with guest #75. The term ‘ghetto’ really is in no way absolutely 100% associated with ‘black’, especially for most people in Toronto or Canada for that matter. I know MANY, MANY people myself included who have used the term ghetto to refer to things which are simply put ‘not that great’. For instance ‘ghetto restaurant’ means it looks pretty run down, ‘ghetto car’ means the car is old, and so on. In fact in the Jewish neighbourhood I grew up in, ghetto probably meant ‘Warsaw city quarter where the Nazis housed the Jews’ more than anything else.
    Secondly, while it is true that ‘someone’ talked to his mom over the phone, how do we know it was Siu at all? She just looked at his name, which could have easily been the name of a white person.
    Thirdly, as someone else pointed out, the media frequently embellishes a lot. His resume was not as ‘stellar’ as it was presented. I know a LOT of political science students at UofT with equivalent or better resumes then what they listed there. Perhaps compared to other candidates he really WAS ‘ghetto’ (as in not as good), who are we to say?
    Fourthly, it was obviously a mistake and blaming the entire McGuinty government about this is pretty stupid. You can’t control the thoughts of everyone, and you can pretty much bet that most people out there have made statements like this in the past. Yes it was unprofessional to be doing so at work, but it happens all the time, and remember… this statement wasn’t necessarily racist. Pretend that she said ‘look at this guy’s stupid resume!’ would the uproar then be ‘wow they called him ‘stupid’ because he’s black!”?
    The media frequently oversensationalizes things to get attention. I have seen this over and over again. In fact I remember a few years ago, when we held a debate at UofT about terrorism. It was clearly stated BEFORE the debate that the debators were merely arguing a position, and what they said was DEFINATELY not their personal opinion. Yet when one person who’s side it was, was to defend terrorism (because they were arguing on the opposing side of the debate) the next day the Star had a nice article about how this guy was all loving Islamic fundamentalism and there was a mini-uproar in the letters to the editor about him, when all he did was participate in an academic debate not of his own personal opinion.
    The media frequently skews things, and regardless of the incident, I think Aileen has learned her lesson and I think people should let this issue die.

  • guest

    True THAT, guess 79

  • ChrisD

    One problem is when white people set themselves up as experts or arbiters of what is or is not racist. “Ghetto dude” has racialized subtext and association, referring to Malvern as a ghetto has racialized subtext and associations. I doubt Ms. Sui wears bed sheets or burns crosses, but her language reflects an internalized cultural belief that black people are not acceptable for certain workplaces. Systemic racist cultural assumptions are reflected in coded and codified language and behaviour. The majority of people racialized as black are aware of and experienced in deciphering this language and behaviour. It might help if one were to defer to their expertise.
    As Sandra Carnegie-Douglas President of the Jamaican Canadian Association commented in a letter to the Toronto Star
    “The reference to Evon Reid as the “ghetto dude” points to the more serious and entrenched problem of systemic racism and, in particular, anti-black racism in the public sector. The sad thing about this whole affair is that so many African Canadians can cite similar experiences of discriminatory treatment within the public service. Needless to say, the apology from Premier Dalton McGuinty was in order. However, far more must be done to confront and eliminate systemic racism within the public service.
    Summing up this situation, as the cabinet office manager did, to “being totally inappropriate” and “an error in judgment” is inadequate and unacceptable. It’s fortunate for Reid that he received first-hand knowledge of this offensive treatment and was able to leverage immediate public response from the Ontario public service and the government.”
    I still do not think it is appropriate to call Aileen Sui “a racist” and vilify or target her, that ignores the fact that she is expressing a common cultural assumption.

  • joeclark

    I assume you’re all capable of Googling a concept that’s new to you. The fact that top-posting is a new concept bodes ill for your computer acumen. (In other words, it means you do it yourself.)
    An apparent inability even to Google it (I just have to select the words and right-click; you?) bodes… what is the term? iller.
    Top-posters commit fuckups of the sort Aileen Siu did. The rest of us do not commit those sorts of fuckups.

  • guest

    The term “ghetto” may be considered negative, but I believe in this case it was taken out of context. Ghetto does not necessarily mean black, I know people who use the term to describe things that are considered older that we may hear described as “old school”. After reading the article, although Ms Siu is at fault for using the term, I think Mr. Reid took his story to The Star for his own personal gain. It is evident since the last portion of the article contains Mr. Reids entire resume. Why didn’t he approach Ms. Siu first or her manager directly to express how he felt. The email could have not been referring to Mr. Reid but to a completely different person who is not black. Instead he immediately contacted the Star and because of him he has ruined the career of another young graduate. I know some will feel that he did the right thing by telling the paper, but I think that should have been something he did after approaching Ms. Siu first or if he did not recieve an appropriate response after contacting her or her manager.

  • guest

    joeclark: i agree, the key to success in this world is knowing about why top-posting is bad and how to right click to search. Our education system must respond to what is clearly a lack of personal responsibility and general laziness that is leading society into ruin.